Smoking ban set to move forward
4/28/2009
By DAVID CLOUSTON, Salina Journal
Commissioners forgo opportunity to repeal ban that takes effect Saturday
Salina city commissioners Monday discussed, but let pass, the opportunity to repeal or delay a comprehensive citywide ban on smoking in public places scheduled to take effect Saturday.
They took no action after commissioner Aaron Peck chastised the leading advocate for repeal for insinuating that voters would be too stupid to figure out their ballots if opponents petitioned for a public vote.
"Let's face it, some voters are more or less likely to be confused, and or less sophisticated than others at the ballot," Gary Swartzendruber, of Salina, told commissioners.
"I am asking for one of you to initiate the motion to repeal the ban. And I'm asking that at least three of you vote for a repeal," he said.
If the ordinance were repealed, Swartzendruber argued, supporters of the ban would have to petition to keep the ordinance in force, "creating a clear choice for the voters -- yes ban, or no ban. That's all I'm asking."
A group of Salinans against the stricter smoking ban already have collected signatures on a petition calling for a public vote on its repeal.
Anti-smoking advocates favor the ordinance set to take effect at the end of this week. It bans smoking in nearly all public places, including bars, bingo parlors, bowling alleys, hotels, motels and restaurants. It would replace the current ordinance, which bans smoking in restaurants except between 9 p.m. and 5 a.m.
One man's opinion?
Peck said Swartzendruber's argument that the new ordinance represented too much government intrusion and restriction on small businesses was not justification but an opinion. And Peck had stronger words for Swartzendruber's comment about "less sophisticated" voters.
"It assumes those against the ordinance or those who happen to have an addiction to nicotine are somehow, in your own words, 'less sophisticated,' or as I read it, less intelligent than the rest of the community," Peck said.
"That assumption is where the rest of your case is made. And I simply don't buy it," Peck said. "I don't think we need to generalize that a particular segment of the community is somehow less sophisticated or not smart enough to figure out how the ballot reads."
Swartzendruber was the leading opponent of the current restaurant smoking ordinance, passed by city commissioners seven years ago.
The opponents, who successfully petitioned for a public vote, also challenged at that time that the wording would be confusing for some voters.
Voters at that time were asked to vote "yes" to repeal the ordinance or "no" to retain the ordinance. The vote was 6,157 "yes" to 8,849 "no" -- meaning the vote to repeal failed 41 percent to 59 percent and the ordinance remained in effect.
If opponents of the new ordinance submit their petitions calling for a vote, wording of the ballot would be similar.
Wording not confusing
A member of the public who spoke at Monday's city commission meeting, Morea Charvat, 2606 Plantation, said she didn't think there was much confusion about the ballot question seven years ago.
"There was a lot of public education prior to that. And I think people understood what they were voting on," she said. "I am for protecting the health of our whole community."
Commissioners let pass a suggestion from commissioner Tom Arpke, who wasn't present but was participating by conference call, to delay implementation of the ordinance until the next general election, when it could be voted upon.
City Manager Jason Gage said it was possible to delay the ordinance that long, but in the meantime, the chances were good that either those for or against the ordinance would submit the necessary petitions to call for a special election.
"This may very well move on its own, regardless of what you, as a commission, choose to do at this time," Gage said.
n Reporter David Clouston can be reached at 822-1403 or by e-mail at dclouston@salina.com.
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Cigarettes with my drinks says....
How many years has America sold cigarettes? How many places were you able to smoke 35 years ago?? Hospitals....librarys....ect. Now your telling me that after years and years of the government allowing this plus, everyone believing this was the "norm" that not only will the government make me pay half of my price of cigarettes in taxes AND be banned from all public places?? I understand stores and hospitals and malls and movie theaters but damn, even the BARS?? Owners should have a right to choose and if there are so many non smokers then I'm sure there won't be a problem getting at least half of the bars to follow along but to take away ALL rights is just a dictatorship!
5/20/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Julie--If you don't want to smell second hand smoke, that is your prerogative. There are bars in Salina that cater to non smoking customers. Show your support for non smoking businesses by spending money with them. Allow the owners to decide.
5/20/2009
Informed Individual says....
Former Smoker: Minority yes..thus our rights need to be preserved. Was that not what was pushed during the civil rights movement. Realistically there is no difference. By the way..save us some money and stop driving your vehicle since you take in more of those pollutants every day. If everone quit smoking...who is going to pay for health care for all those children who are on government insurance.
5/19/2009
former smoker says....
Such whinners. Entire states like Colorado and Virginia are smoke free inside buildings. For 20% of smokers in the world. Quit smoking. Issue solved. Even when I smoked I didn't want to smell smoke in restaurants. You are a minority not majority. Save money quit smoking
5/19/2009
Informed Individual says....
To the indivdual with no name...Salina did not get rid of smoking in Salina..just inside a business. I do not have all the time in the world to blog either.
5/19/2009
says....
about time we got rid of smoking inside within the city of salina...now informed individual go post somewhere else, since you seem to have all the time in the world to blog...you are salina's superbooger or superblogger i mean..
5/18/2009
rick says....
Just another reason I hate Salina.
5/18/2009
LAURA says....
to 'informed individual',I responded to your challenge of me,the journal did'nt print it,selective journalism I guess.Anyway,lively debate,sorry the journal is such a lousy form of news,but I guess they side with your position.So,you win.Thanks for your fine journalism salina journal.THANK GOD FOR CABLE NEWS!
5/18/2009
GOTTA LOVE STUPID says....
TO Mary I'M BORN IN CALIFORNIA AND MOVED TO KANSAS BECAUSE THE AIR IS CLEANER HERE EVEN WITH THE SMOKERS THAN THE AIR IN CALIFORNIA EVEN ON CROP BURNING DAY HERE IS HER COMMENT Mary says.... My hat is of to you for smoke free Salina. Born in Kansas live in Califoria. Everything is smoke free here and very enjoyable. 4/30/2009 OK NOW FOR SOME FEEDBACK CALIFORNIA IS NOT SO GREAT NEXT THIN YOU WILL BE SAYING IS YOU LIVE IN LA OR WOW NORTHERN CALIFORNIA GLAD TO SEE YOU HAVE LEFT FOR A STATE WHERE THE CRIME RATE AND DRUG ABUSE AND CORRUPTION IS MORE RAMPID THAN IN D.C. GOOD FOR YOU AND REMEMBER NEX WEEK THEY ARE GOING TO OUTLAW BLACK CARS TO BE SOLD OR DRIVEN IN CALI AND THEN THE WEEK AFTER THAT THEY WILL FINE EVERYONE FOR HAVING A HOUSE THAT IS NOT EARTHQUAKE , NUKE, TIDLEWAVE AND FIRE PROOF AND MAYBE EVEN BETTER THEY WILL ADD NOT GETTING YOU CAR TO PASS SMOG TESTING PART OF THE THREE STRIKES OUT PROGRAM STRIKE ONE YOU USED TOO MUCH OF THE WRONG KIND OF TOILET PAPER FOR YOUR COMMUNITY STRIKE TWO YOU EVEN FLUSHED THAT WRONG TOILET PAPER DOWN THE DRAIN AND STRIKE THREE THAT TOILET PAPER THAT YOU USED WAS THE WRONG TYPE AND YOU ALSO FLUSHED IT DOWN THE DRAIN IS NOW ENDANGERING THE BROWN SEWER LOG SNAKE AND NOW THERE WILL BE NO MORE FLUSHING OF TOILET'S BETWEEN THE HOURS OF 8AM MONDAY JUNE 1ST 2009 UNTIL THE END OF THE WORLD GO KANSAFORNIA YOU ROCK!!!!!!!!!
5/17/2009
Informed Individual says....
Sensitive Nonsmoker...it used to be smokers were more considerate, but with all the push to limit them on when, where they can smoke...why should they be more considerate. Those pushing the laws are not being considerate of the smoker are they?
5/15/2009
Informed Individual says....
Luara...your comment about those who have yet to die..that does not work with statistics...the number of deaths is per year, not a grand total. Please do the research and comprehend it versus taking it verbatum from non-smoking advocates and using it to justify your position on smoking.
5/15/2009
Informed Individual says....
Luara..Did you actually research, read what I wrote and comprehend the studies. 25000 of 50000 had pre-existing medical conditions, which of course fell in the realm of what about heart disease ect..which you mentioned. Hence smoking contributed to the death of 25000 not the cause of, but then again so did your vehicle exhaust. As far as car emission laws reducing pollutents..sure has..but go look up what is still put in the air from vehical emmissions and the studies and you will see you take in more of the pollutants that you advocate against smoking. I have done my research..go do yours. I have not slanted anything. Told you where to go find the information, how it has been interpreted by doctors and myself.
5/15/2009
sensitive nonsmoker says....
I don't smoke and I enjoy the right to not smoke if I don't want to. On the other hand I understand that smokers want the right to smoke. All we non-smokers really ask is that you do it with consideration of others. but because most smokers don't care where they throw their butts or blow their smoke. You have the right to smoke, but remember, I also have the right to not smoke and that includes 2nd hand.
5/14/2009
E.B says....
To all of the wanna be doctors out the a smoking ban isnt going to stop me from smoking and i hope i am standing next to you in the street when i light up
5/14/2009
Laura says....
Informed Indivdual,by your count,25,000 peoples health affected,3,000 died of lung cancer,how many are yet to die that are dying?Also how about the proven cigarette smoke causing high blood pressure,heart desease,strokes,and emphasema,premature aging of the skin,'informed idividual'I profess that you juggle numbers for your slanted argument that does not care for other peoples health,that is very selfish.Secondly,you recite car emmisions,I do believe their has been restrictions and emmission controls for vehicles for years and more to come.You do need more information,or face the true facts.Laura
5/13/2009
Janice says....
CL,the walled off room would separate the smokers from nonsmokers,the exhaust fan taking the smoke outside,everyone happy,and more paying customers.They are simply separated,I know one bar that put in a window glass partition so no one feel alienated,and can come and go to the 'smoker'room at will.Incidently..the economy is bad right now for everyone.
5/13/2009
Informed Individual says....
Laura..has far as saying im not informed about smoking...you do realize that out of 50000 2nd hand smoking related deaths only a max of half are directly attributed to the smoke..or in other words at least 25000 people had health conditions exasperbated by 2nd smoke. Only 3000 out of those 25000 people died of lung cancer who were non-smokers. Now compare that to the approx 15000 liquor related dates reported by the cdc.. and you are going after smoking. Do some research on vehical exhaust and compare it to 2nd smoke. You will see similar chemical make-up. Now which do you breath more of in each day? Please Laura..tell me where I am not informed. Since I just sited you statistics and references.
5/13/2009
CL says....
Response to Janice: The "smart" bar owners that I know have made alterations and renovations to accommodate this ban and are still struggling more than they were before the ban was put in place. I would like for you to explain the drywall room with an exhaust fan and how that applies to this ban, wouldn't that be considered "inside"? I may be at a loss of information as I haven't heard of that as being an option.
5/13/2009
Laura says....
to 'informed individual',...You are anything BUT.
5/12/2009
June says....
to WOW,twenty people gathered in salina spells trouble huh?Well so much for river festivals,funerals,weddings,parades,etc.WOW!!!!!!!!!!!
5/12/2009
Janice says....
response to CL:The smart bar owners will thrive,'build it an they will come",a patio,beer garden,and even a drywalled room,with an exhaust fan will work fine.Any other amenities will be up to the individual bar owners,I see why you are a 'former'bar owner.
5/12/2009
WOW says....
all this ban is doing is contributing to the loitering around area businesses.. i would rather walk into a smoke filled bar than see 20 people outside throwing cig butts all over the ground.. not to mention 20 people outside together in salina only spells trouble.. smart move saline... NOT!!!
5/12/2009
CL says....
Since the smoking ban has been in place, the bar business in Salina has taken a nosedive financially. I am a former bar owner and frequent alot of the smaller "mom & pop" bars/taverns and the negative impact of the ban is even worse than I ever imagined. I have heard a few bar owners say that they may be forced to sell or close their businesses due to this ban. Is there any way that a waiver with a fee can be established to help these businesses like in Wyandotte County? I think it would be interesting to see the differences of income of Salina bars for the month before the ban versus the month after the ban. It seems to me that the City Commission is much more interested in control than helping small business owners in Salina succeed...that is just really sad if you ask me!
5/12/2009
Dana says....
Sheila:The people have decided,all over this land.Your Going to lose this one.Get used to It.
5/12/2009
YAY YAY YAY says....
YAY!
5/11/2009
sheila says....
Still hoping that Ben and Tom will print the study on SHS that they have had for over a week and a half. It states that there is NO statistical proof that smoking bans reduce heart attacks or mortality rates. PLEASE print it, and let the people decide. You guys print ANYTHING from the pro ban crowd. What about a little show of non bias here.
5/11/2009
smokinkat says....
I have to say this ban is saving me money. I smoke, but being that I can't go to the bars and smoke, I will stay home. It's the liqueur stores that are going to be profiting from this ban. The price of 2-3 drinks at the bar just bought me a bottle of liqueur and a 2 liter of soda. But, next you know, the City is going to charge higher taxes on liqueur, and a luxury tax on pool tables.
5/10/2009
Craig says....
Moving...just shut up and move! Need boxes?
5/8/2009
Both sides are losing says....
People need to realize that they are complaining about our shortfall on taxes, yet they are banning smoking from things people like to do. How do you think this will effect the ecomony of this town and the smokers and non smokers alike? The businesses are going to either have to do some addition or up the prices in order to keep in business and people feel that they can't relax and enjoy a smoke with their meal or drink. How about those who want to be smoking establishments get a waiver like Witchia instead of remodeling? Keeps the ecomony and the waiver helps the city and we all know what is and is not smoke free before we enter!
5/8/2009
Informed Individual says....
For those who are afraid of all the toxins from 2nd hand smoke...you do realize you take in more of those pollutants everyday from your vehical right, I am sure you know this since you seem to know what is best for everybody instead of just yourself.
5/7/2009
Julie says....
HERR KOMMISSAR,let me try to explain this to you,this is about stimulating the economy,if businessess cater to BOTH smokers and non smokers,its more money in their profit margin,by maybe fifty percent or more.And if you don't like it,you can leave.Got it?
5/6/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Juli, understand something. I DON'T SMOKE. This is not about smokers vs. non smokers, not for me anyway. It is about business owners being able to chose who they wish to cater to. If I did smoke, and I walked into a business which allowed smoking, if you did not like it you could get up and leave. If second hand smoke is that offensive to you, you really need to patronize the non smoking bars in town. Show the smoking bars how much business they are losing.
5/6/2009
Julie says....
Herr Kommissar!I don't want to breath your stinking second hand smoke,so does that mean if you walk into a bar where I'm at,then I must leave?Or move?It would be so much easier if you would just be polite and inhale your poison outside.
5/6/2009
Pro-Business Owners says....
This isn't about the smokers versus the non-smokers. It's about the BUSINESS OWNERS RIGHT TO CHOOSE HOW THEY WANT TO RUN THEIR BUSINESS. They pay taxes, and it's THEIR livelihood. Let's say they lose 5 customers that spend an average of $30 once a week at that business. That's $150/week.. $600/month.. and $7,200/year in lost revenue. Can the city PROMISE that lost revenue will be replaced by non-smokers that are specifically coming into that business BECAUSE of the smoking ban? NO!!! So the government intrusion is potentially costing the business owners' money, and it's not right.
5/6/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
gabester. Do you really want to know what happen to the America you and I grew up in? People like Liz, who can't think for themselves, decided the government should be able to dictate everything that everybody can and cannot do. They will not be satisfied until there are no more personal freedoms. Every aspect of our daily lives will be controlled by Big Brother.
5/5/2009
Eddie Western says....
I feel that the business owner should be the person to decide if he/she wants to ban smoking in his/her establishment. The consumer can then choose if he/she wants to spend their money at that business. By allowing the gov't to control if you can smoke or not in a private establishment takes away our freedom of choice.
5/4/2009
gabester says....
I am a non smoker, but I also believe in freedom. One of the most basic freedoms we have is the freedom to make decisions, now big government is taking that away more and more every day the smoking ban is just one of the ways,, welcome to the socialist city of Salina, Kansas, whats next 5 dollar a pound tax on red meat because its bad for us.? Think people before all our freedoms are lost.
5/4/2009
gabester_radio.com says....
what happen to the America I grew up in? The America of FREEDOM I am an ex smoker so the ban does not effect me EXCEPT for the lose of freedom everyone in this city has lost. Big government taxes cigarettes high because they say its bad for our health.. what is next a 5 dollar a pound tax on red meat because its bad for us???? what can I tell you we brought this on ourselvs by voting for liberals. vote for more of them and see more of your freedoms go by the wayside Gabe from gabester_radio
5/4/2009
mack says....
useless law pass by small minded leaders, support by stupid people
5/2/2009
Liz says....
herr kommissar!Then speak for yourself big man.I personally do not believe you speak for many others nor would they want you to.You Herr,simply are not likable enough to have 'many' friends.If YOU don't like progress in salina maybe YOU should move.We'll all take a deep fresh breath of air if you do.
5/1/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Liz---I can speak for myself, my family, and all of my friends who support the same ideals as I. You don't like the way WE like things around here, maybe you should move to Illinois with boy.
5/1/2009
Moving says....
We are moving out of this town..this town's abuse of power is getting way out of hand...this is still America and freedom used to mean more to people. Now it is about controlling and punishing and making money off of good people. Smokers are 3rd class citizens and pay a TON in extra taxes...as a non smoker I feel we owe them the courtesy of not imprisoning them within their own house if they want to smoke. After all they pay for...I just bought my spouse a can of American Spirit natural tobacco the other day at House of Sight and Sound. It used to be 17 dollars a can and within a couple of weeks the price is now almost 50 dollars with tax. And we hardly have anywhere to go out to except maybe bowling where he is free to smoke. This will be even worse if I go out I will only run into a lot less colorful people Your shunning an entire part of the populace who won't even be able to smoke in the tobacco store...Shame on you Salina...I am so outta here and I hope to take as many sensible people with me. I want to live somewhere that there are open minded progressive citizens that are accepting of others. If this is what Salina wants, see what they end up with... A police state and a bunch of whiners...
5/1/2009
Mary says....
My hat is of to you for smoke free Salina. Born in Kansas live in Califoria. Everything is smoke free here and very enjoyable.
4/30/2009
Liz says....
HERR KOMMISSAR!You keep saying "WE" in your most recent stupid posts,please speak for yourself and you only.
4/30/2009
Smkoer Untill I QUIT says....
I agree with Stop Being Sheep I moved here from California about 15 years ago and all I see here is sheep in this town everyone wants the State, City , County to take away our rights as Americans next thing you know we will not be able to BBQ outside with our family and friends because the smell of the cooking animals is bothering the vegetarian next door and they will be asking the police or county commissioners to set fins and take people to jail I DO SMOKE but and trying to quit but I do not need a bunch or officials or non smokers telling me I can't smoke did we all forget a couple weeks ago when all the farmers were burning their fields ? tell me the difference between 100 smokers and 20 fields going up in smoke ? and as a smoker the fields burning make even me gag and choke up so now are we going to ban field burns ? and why not it is just as bad a tobacco everywhere you look nowadays you see ad's about all the chemicals in tobacco what about all the chemicals on and in those fields that are burning? JUST THINK ABOUT IT SOON THEY WILL BE TELLING ALL OF YOU ATE THE DOUGHNUT SHOP , COFFEE HOUSES ,OR RUSSLES EATING BREAKFAST THAT YOU CAN NOT DRINK COFFEE OR LET ALONG DRIVE YOUR CARE BECAUSE YOU HAD A TICKET GET YOUR NOSES OUT OF THE AIR COME DOWN OUT OF THE SALINA SNOB HILL AND GET DOWN TO EARTH IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THE SMOKE STAY OUT AND AWAY FROM WHERE THEY ALLOW SMOKE AND FOR THE ESTABLISHMENTS THAT ALLOWED SMOKING MAYBE IF YOU WERE SMART ENOUGH TO PUT THE SMOKING SECTION IN THE BACK AND US SMOKERS WAITING TO SMOKE WHEN WE GET DONE EATING WE ALL WOULD PROBABLY NOT EVEN BE HAVING THIS DISCUSSION RIGHT NOW
4/30/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Citizen Kane, the thing is not about smokers versus non smokers. I don't smoke, I prefer to be in places where there is not smoke, but I beleive in limited government governing our individual lives and our businesses. If the individual business wants to go non smoking, fine. We just don't want government telling us every little thing we can and cannot do!
4/29/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
llinois boy, you need to remember something. This ain't Illinois! We don't need our politicians telling us what we can and cannot do with our private businesses. Since you are from the land of corrupt politicians, these bans imposed by worthless government wastes of skin probably make you feel right at home, don't they. Since you are so proud of the fact that you are from Illinois, why don't you either stay there or move there? We don't need your liberal nanny state mentality in Kansas.
4/29/2009
Hawk says....
Older Teen, getting a ticket for public intoxication is a hell of alot cheaper than a DUI or killing someone or yourself. By the way, why are you worried about being intoxicated since your supposedly a teen?? Another thing, learn how to spell "you" and "are"!!
4/29/2009
sheila says....
Simply AMAZED. The new Council members said that they supported small business rights, then they just sat there and did NOTHING. Looks like SEVERAL somebodies lied flat out. AMAZING
4/29/2009
Citizen Kane says....
I find it humorous some of the pathetic posts made by smokers on here. "blahblahblah" says that "if you don't like smoke, go somwhere else." Well, the same thing applies to you fool! If you want to smoke, go somewhere else. No one wants to smell your nasty self! Just another dumb Liberal comment with no real brains or common sense behind it.
4/29/2009
Aaron says....
Older Teen: What language was that???? Good lord it isn't that hard to spell Y.O.U. or A.R.E. Learn to freaking spell. "ok so if we r cat a bar u r saying that us smokers have to go outside and that a chance on getting a ticket for intoxiction in public
4/29/2009
jason says....
welcome to the 21st century salina.Not having to breath second hand smoke should be a right,that goes for you dopers and mariuana as well.
4/29/2009
says says....
Just goes to show how trustworthy candidates who run for city,county offices are in Salina/Saline County really are. Angell,Arpke and Jennings said they were for letting business owners deciede to smoke or not to smoke at their businesses, now all of a sudden they ignore Gary Swartzendrubers plea to vote on the issue. Out of the woodwork comes Arron Peck , who by the way proably has not said too much the past 11/2 yrs at a city commission meeting except yes or no, and goes bananas at Swartzendruber. I voted for all 3 of these "people" but I guess I learned my lesson. Thought Salina got rid of 2 faced people on the city commisson when Jilka and Perney left, guess not.
4/29/2009
OLDER TEEN says....
ok so if we r cat a bar u r saying that us smokers have to go outside and that a chance on getting a ticket for intoxiction in public
4/29/2009
Keri says....
Way to go Salina!
4/28/2009
illinois boy says....
I am happy to finally see a strong Smoking Ban in Salinas. It is way overdue. Most smokers even favor the new Law.
4/28/2009
Brenda says....
i think we should let the owners of the establishments decide whether or not to have smoking in their bulding. this is the land of the free so why are taking rights away from some.
4/28/2009
Smoke Free Kansas says....
Please Step Outside To Smoke-Thank You!! What is so difficult about that??
4/28/2009
Smoke Free Kansas says....
Who could be so ignorant at to confuse "business rights" with the right to enter a business open to the PUBLIC and breathe clean fresh smoke free air?? What is so difficult about asking smokers to step outside and smoke?? Some of you hicks in Salina are having trouble with going outside to smoke?? Get off your lazy a** and step outside.
4/28/2009
frieda says....
to chuck : you all have the choice of where to stop or not ! a sad day indeed that 2 ignore the other 3 !
4/28/2009
Lucretius says....
This is an excellent example of the antiAmerican stupidity of our citizens who don't want freedom and the right to choose. They want the government to perpetually hold their hands and keep the monster in the closet. I don't need nor want that kind of suffocating protection from our Government. I believe in freedom--apparently most citizens do not anymore. They are tearing away the wall, brick by brick, of freedom.
4/28/2009
Chris says....
The wording should be: "Does a private business owner have the right to allow a legal behavior on their privately owned business property? YES or NO
4/28/2009
Amy says....
It would seem to me that you had enough before, this is needless, not to mention that Im pretty sure alot of people in America are getting tired of useless laws and regulations being forced down their throat when money could be spent better else where. THis is not fair and impartial representation by the city comission.
4/28/2009
says....
A person using a cell phone does not affect another person
4/28/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Hey Chuck--- The only places that you can currently smoke in Salina is Bars and Bingo Parlors. Why are you so concerned about them? Do your friends and relatives frequently go to those places? When you are passing through do you stop to get a few beers before you get on the road again? What is the next thing to ban? When I drive past Bosselman's Truck Plaza every morning on the interstate, the Ninth Street exchange reeks of diesel fumes. Diesel fumes are not good for you either. Lets ban semi's!!!!!!!!!!
4/28/2009
aaron says....
Again, we should move forward and ban ALL sales of tobacco in Salina!!!!! If its THAT bad we should not be allowed to buy it!
4/28/2009
blahblahblah says....
Meh...I'm tired of all this crap. I like that it's smoke free, but dammit, sometimes I like to enjoy a smoke with my after dinner cocktail and if a restaurant wishes to cater to me and others like me they should be allowed to do so! If you don't like the smoke, go somewhere else. If you don't like to work in smoke get another job!
4/28/2009
says....
Cell phone are not good for our health, i think we should banned cell phones in public places
4/28/2009
chuck says....
We don't live in Salina but have friends and relatives there and appreciate what the city has done to reduce exposure to tobacco smoke. We also pass through quite often and appreciate the fact that we can stop at anytime and not be exposed to secondhand smoke. Thank you Salina.
4/28/2009
says....
good job commissioners..Keep it up...
4/28/2009
Bob says....
Voting is not allowed. Read the instructions. www.no-smoke.org/pdf/CIA_Fundamentals.pdf
4/28/2009
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Beth says....
RESPONSE to cigarettes with my drink"Do you grasp that you spelled out the anti smoking argument?35 yrs ago,we blew second hand smoke in our childrens lungs,hospitals,homes,everywhere...We hopefully have learned from that stupidity and will respect others health or at least the children..good point cigarette.Wishing the best for you.
5/22/2009
Cigarettes with my drinks says....
How many years has America sold cigarettes? How many places were you able to smoke 35 years ago?? Hospitals....librarys....ect. Now your telling me that after years and years of the government allowing this plus, everyone believing this was the "norm" that not only will the government make me pay half of my price of cigarettes in taxes AND be banned from all public places?? I understand stores and hospitals and malls and movie theaters but damn, even the BARS?? Owners should have a right to choose and if there are so many non smokers then I'm sure there won't be a problem getting at least half of the bars to follow along but to take away ALL rights is just a dictatorship!
5/20/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Julie--If you don't want to smell second hand smoke, that is your prerogative. There are bars in Salina that cater to non smoking customers. Show your support for non smoking businesses by spending money with them. Allow the owners to decide.
5/20/2009
Informed Individual says....
Former Smoker: Minority yes..thus our rights need to be preserved. Was that not what was pushed during the civil rights movement. Realistically there is no difference. By the way..save us some money and stop driving your vehicle since you take in more of those pollutants every day. If everone quit smoking...who is going to pay for health care for all those children who are on government insurance.
5/19/2009
former smoker says....
Such whinners. Entire states like Colorado and Virginia are smoke free inside buildings. For 20% of smokers in the world. Quit smoking. Issue solved. Even when I smoked I didn't want to smell smoke in restaurants. You are a minority not majority. Save money quit smoking
5/19/2009
Informed Individual says....
To the indivdual with no name...Salina did not get rid of smoking in Salina..just inside a business. I do not have all the time in the world to blog either.
5/19/2009
says....
about time we got rid of smoking inside within the city of salina...now informed individual go post somewhere else, since you seem to have all the time in the world to blog...you are salina's superbooger or superblogger i mean..
5/18/2009
rick says....
Just another reason I hate Salina.
5/18/2009
LAURA says....
to 'informed individual',I responded to your challenge of me,the journal did'nt print it,selective journalism I guess.Anyway,lively debate,sorry the journal is such a lousy form of news,but I guess they side with your position.So,you win.Thanks for your fine journalism salina journal.THANK GOD FOR CABLE NEWS!
5/18/2009
GOTTA LOVE STUPID says....
TO Mary I'M BORN IN CALIFORNIA AND MOVED TO KANSAS BECAUSE THE AIR IS CLEANER HERE EVEN WITH THE SMOKERS THAN THE AIR IN CALIFORNIA EVEN ON CROP BURNING DAY HERE IS HER COMMENT Mary says.... My hat is of to you for smoke free Salina. Born in Kansas live in Califoria. Everything is smoke free here and very enjoyable. 4/30/2009 OK NOW FOR SOME FEEDBACK CALIFORNIA IS NOT SO GREAT NEXT THIN YOU WILL BE SAYING IS YOU LIVE IN LA OR WOW NORTHERN CALIFORNIA GLAD TO SEE YOU HAVE LEFT FOR A STATE WHERE THE CRIME RATE AND DRUG ABUSE AND CORRUPTION IS MORE RAMPID THAN IN D.C. GOOD FOR YOU AND REMEMBER NEX WEEK THEY ARE GOING TO OUTLAW BLACK CARS TO BE SOLD OR DRIVEN IN CALI AND THEN THE WEEK AFTER THAT THEY WILL FINE EVERYONE FOR HAVING A HOUSE THAT IS NOT EARTHQUAKE , NUKE, TIDLEWAVE AND FIRE PROOF AND MAYBE EVEN BETTER THEY WILL ADD NOT GETTING YOU CAR TO PASS SMOG TESTING PART OF THE THREE STRIKES OUT PROGRAM STRIKE ONE YOU USED TOO MUCH OF THE WRONG KIND OF TOILET PAPER FOR YOUR COMMUNITY STRIKE TWO YOU EVEN FLUSHED THAT WRONG TOILET PAPER DOWN THE DRAIN AND STRIKE THREE THAT TOILET PAPER THAT YOU USED WAS THE WRONG TYPE AND YOU ALSO FLUSHED IT DOWN THE DRAIN IS NOW ENDANGERING THE BROWN SEWER LOG SNAKE AND NOW THERE WILL BE NO MORE FLUSHING OF TOILET'S BETWEEN THE HOURS OF 8AM MONDAY JUNE 1ST 2009 UNTIL THE END OF THE WORLD GO KANSAFORNIA YOU ROCK!!!!!!!!!
5/17/2009
Informed Individual says....
Sensitive Nonsmoker...it used to be smokers were more considerate, but with all the push to limit them on when, where they can smoke...why should they be more considerate. Those pushing the laws are not being considerate of the smoker are they?
5/15/2009
Informed Individual says....
Luara...your comment about those who have yet to die..that does not work with statistics...the number of deaths is per year, not a grand total. Please do the research and comprehend it versus taking it verbatum from non-smoking advocates and using it to justify your position on smoking.
5/15/2009
Informed Individual says....
Luara..Did you actually research, read what I wrote and comprehend the studies. 25000 of 50000 had pre-existing medical conditions, which of course fell in the realm of what about heart disease ect..which you mentioned. Hence smoking contributed to the death of 25000 not the cause of, but then again so did your vehicle exhaust. As far as car emission laws reducing pollutents..sure has..but go look up what is still put in the air from vehical emmissions and the studies and you will see you take in more of the pollutants that you advocate against smoking. I have done my research..go do yours. I have not slanted anything. Told you where to go find the information, how it has been interpreted by doctors and myself.
5/15/2009
sensitive nonsmoker says....
I don't smoke and I enjoy the right to not smoke if I don't want to. On the other hand I understand that smokers want the right to smoke. All we non-smokers really ask is that you do it with consideration of others. but because most smokers don't care where they throw their butts or blow their smoke. You have the right to smoke, but remember, I also have the right to not smoke and that includes 2nd hand.
5/14/2009
E.B says....
To all of the wanna be doctors out the a smoking ban isnt going to stop me from smoking and i hope i am standing next to you in the street when i light up
5/14/2009
Laura says....
Informed Indivdual,by your count,25,000 peoples health affected,3,000 died of lung cancer,how many are yet to die that are dying?Also how about the proven cigarette smoke causing high blood pressure,heart desease,strokes,and emphasema,premature aging of the skin,'informed idividual'I profess that you juggle numbers for your slanted argument that does not care for other peoples health,that is very selfish.Secondly,you recite car emmisions,I do believe their has been restrictions and emmission controls for vehicles for years and more to come.You do need more information,or face the true facts.Laura
5/13/2009
Janice says....
CL,the walled off room would separate the smokers from nonsmokers,the exhaust fan taking the smoke outside,everyone happy,and more paying customers.They are simply separated,I know one bar that put in a window glass partition so no one feel alienated,and can come and go to the 'smoker'room at will.Incidently..the economy is bad right now for everyone.
5/13/2009
Informed Individual says....
Laura..has far as saying im not informed about smoking...you do realize that out of 50000 2nd hand smoking related deaths only a max of half are directly attributed to the smoke..or in other words at least 25000 people had health conditions exasperbated by 2nd smoke. Only 3000 out of those 25000 people died of lung cancer who were non-smokers. Now compare that to the approx 15000 liquor related dates reported by the cdc.. and you are going after smoking. Do some research on vehical exhaust and compare it to 2nd smoke. You will see similar chemical make-up. Now which do you breath more of in each day? Please Laura..tell me where I am not informed. Since I just sited you statistics and references.
5/13/2009
CL says....
Response to Janice: The "smart" bar owners that I know have made alterations and renovations to accommodate this ban and are still struggling more than they were before the ban was put in place. I would like for you to explain the drywall room with an exhaust fan and how that applies to this ban, wouldn't that be considered "inside"? I may be at a loss of information as I haven't heard of that as being an option.
5/13/2009
Laura says....
to 'informed individual',...You are anything BUT.
5/12/2009
June says....
to WOW,twenty people gathered in salina spells trouble huh?Well so much for river festivals,funerals,weddings,parades,etc.WOW!!!!!!!!!!!
5/12/2009
Janice says....
response to CL:The smart bar owners will thrive,'build it an they will come",a patio,beer garden,and even a drywalled room,with an exhaust fan will work fine.Any other amenities will be up to the individual bar owners,I see why you are a 'former'bar owner.
5/12/2009
WOW says....
all this ban is doing is contributing to the loitering around area businesses.. i would rather walk into a smoke filled bar than see 20 people outside throwing cig butts all over the ground.. not to mention 20 people outside together in salina only spells trouble.. smart move saline... NOT!!!
5/12/2009
CL says....
Since the smoking ban has been in place, the bar business in Salina has taken a nosedive financially. I am a former bar owner and frequent alot of the smaller "mom & pop" bars/taverns and the negative impact of the ban is even worse than I ever imagined. I have heard a few bar owners say that they may be forced to sell or close their businesses due to this ban. Is there any way that a waiver with a fee can be established to help these businesses like in Wyandotte County? I think it would be interesting to see the differences of income of Salina bars for the month before the ban versus the month after the ban. It seems to me that the City Commission is much more interested in control than helping small business owners in Salina succeed...that is just really sad if you ask me!
5/12/2009
Dana says....
Sheila:The people have decided,all over this land.Your Going to lose this one.Get used to It.
5/12/2009
YAY YAY YAY says....
YAY!
5/11/2009
sheila says....
Still hoping that Ben and Tom will print the study on SHS that they have had for over a week and a half. It states that there is NO statistical proof that smoking bans reduce heart attacks or mortality rates. PLEASE print it, and let the people decide. You guys print ANYTHING from the pro ban crowd. What about a little show of non bias here.
5/11/2009
smokinkat says....
I have to say this ban is saving me money. I smoke, but being that I can't go to the bars and smoke, I will stay home. It's the liqueur stores that are going to be profiting from this ban. The price of 2-3 drinks at the bar just bought me a bottle of liqueur and a 2 liter of soda. But, next you know, the City is going to charge higher taxes on liqueur, and a luxury tax on pool tables.
5/10/2009
Craig says....
Moving...just shut up and move! Need boxes?
5/8/2009
Both sides are losing says....
People need to realize that they are complaining about our shortfall on taxes, yet they are banning smoking from things people like to do. How do you think this will effect the ecomony of this town and the smokers and non smokers alike? The businesses are going to either have to do some addition or up the prices in order to keep in business and people feel that they can't relax and enjoy a smoke with their meal or drink. How about those who want to be smoking establishments get a waiver like Witchia instead of remodeling? Keeps the ecomony and the waiver helps the city and we all know what is and is not smoke free before we enter!
5/8/2009
Informed Individual says....
For those who are afraid of all the toxins from 2nd hand smoke...you do realize you take in more of those pollutants everyday from your vehical right, I am sure you know this since you seem to know what is best for everybody instead of just yourself.
5/7/2009
Julie says....
HERR KOMMISSAR,let me try to explain this to you,this is about stimulating the economy,if businessess cater to BOTH smokers and non smokers,its more money in their profit margin,by maybe fifty percent or more.And if you don't like it,you can leave.Got it?
5/6/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Juli, understand something. I DON'T SMOKE. This is not about smokers vs. non smokers, not for me anyway. It is about business owners being able to chose who they wish to cater to. If I did smoke, and I walked into a business which allowed smoking, if you did not like it you could get up and leave. If second hand smoke is that offensive to you, you really need to patronize the non smoking bars in town. Show the smoking bars how much business they are losing.
5/6/2009
Julie says....
Herr Kommissar!I don't want to breath your stinking second hand smoke,so does that mean if you walk into a bar where I'm at,then I must leave?Or move?It would be so much easier if you would just be polite and inhale your poison outside.
5/6/2009
Pro-Business Owners says....
This isn't about the smokers versus the non-smokers. It's about the BUSINESS OWNERS RIGHT TO CHOOSE HOW THEY WANT TO RUN THEIR BUSINESS. They pay taxes, and it's THEIR livelihood. Let's say they lose 5 customers that spend an average of $30 once a week at that business. That's $150/week.. $600/month.. and $7,200/year in lost revenue. Can the city PROMISE that lost revenue will be replaced by non-smokers that are specifically coming into that business BECAUSE of the smoking ban? NO!!! So the government intrusion is potentially costing the business owners' money, and it's not right.
5/6/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
gabester. Do you really want to know what happen to the America you and I grew up in? People like Liz, who can't think for themselves, decided the government should be able to dictate everything that everybody can and cannot do. They will not be satisfied until there are no more personal freedoms. Every aspect of our daily lives will be controlled by Big Brother.
5/5/2009
Eddie Western says....
I feel that the business owner should be the person to decide if he/she wants to ban smoking in his/her establishment. The consumer can then choose if he/she wants to spend their money at that business. By allowing the gov't to control if you can smoke or not in a private establishment takes away our freedom of choice.
5/4/2009
gabester says....
I am a non smoker, but I also believe in freedom. One of the most basic freedoms we have is the freedom to make decisions, now big government is taking that away more and more every day the smoking ban is just one of the ways,, welcome to the socialist city of Salina, Kansas, whats next 5 dollar a pound tax on red meat because its bad for us.? Think people before all our freedoms are lost.
5/4/2009
gabester_radio.com says....
what happen to the America I grew up in? The America of FREEDOM I am an ex smoker so the ban does not effect me EXCEPT for the lose of freedom everyone in this city has lost. Big government taxes cigarettes high because they say its bad for our health.. what is next a 5 dollar a pound tax on red meat because its bad for us???? what can I tell you we brought this on ourselvs by voting for liberals. vote for more of them and see more of your freedoms go by the wayside Gabe from gabester_radio
5/4/2009
mack says....
useless law pass by small minded leaders, support by stupid people
5/2/2009
Liz says....
herr kommissar!Then speak for yourself big man.I personally do not believe you speak for many others nor would they want you to.You Herr,simply are not likable enough to have 'many' friends.If YOU don't like progress in salina maybe YOU should move.We'll all take a deep fresh breath of air if you do.
5/1/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Liz---I can speak for myself, my family, and all of my friends who support the same ideals as I. You don't like the way WE like things around here, maybe you should move to Illinois with boy.
5/1/2009
Moving says....
We are moving out of this town..this town's abuse of power is getting way out of hand...this is still America and freedom used to mean more to people. Now it is about controlling and punishing and making money off of good people. Smokers are 3rd class citizens and pay a TON in extra taxes...as a non smoker I feel we owe them the courtesy of not imprisoning them within their own house if they want to smoke. After all they pay for...I just bought my spouse a can of American Spirit natural tobacco the other day at House of Sight and Sound. It used to be 17 dollars a can and within a couple of weeks the price is now almost 50 dollars with tax. And we hardly have anywhere to go out to except maybe bowling where he is free to smoke. This will be even worse if I go out I will only run into a lot less colorful people Your shunning an entire part of the populace who won't even be able to smoke in the tobacco store...Shame on you Salina...I am so outta here and I hope to take as many sensible people with me. I want to live somewhere that there are open minded progressive citizens that are accepting of others. If this is what Salina wants, see what they end up with... A police state and a bunch of whiners...
5/1/2009
Mary says....
My hat is of to you for smoke free Salina. Born in Kansas live in Califoria. Everything is smoke free here and very enjoyable.
4/30/2009
Liz says....
HERR KOMMISSAR!You keep saying "WE" in your most recent stupid posts,please speak for yourself and you only.
4/30/2009
Smkoer Untill I QUIT says....
I agree with Stop Being Sheep I moved here from California about 15 years ago and all I see here is sheep in this town everyone wants the State, City , County to take away our rights as Americans next thing you know we will not be able to BBQ outside with our family and friends because the smell of the cooking animals is bothering the vegetarian next door and they will be asking the police or county commissioners to set fins and take people to jail I DO SMOKE but and trying to quit but I do not need a bunch or officials or non smokers telling me I can't smoke did we all forget a couple weeks ago when all the farmers were burning their fields ? tell me the difference between 100 smokers and 20 fields going up in smoke ? and as a smoker the fields burning make even me gag and choke up so now are we going to ban field burns ? and why not it is just as bad a tobacco everywhere you look nowadays you see ad's about all the chemicals in tobacco what about all the chemicals on and in those fields that are burning? JUST THINK ABOUT IT SOON THEY WILL BE TELLING ALL OF YOU ATE THE DOUGHNUT SHOP , COFFEE HOUSES ,OR RUSSLES EATING BREAKFAST THAT YOU CAN NOT DRINK COFFEE OR LET ALONG DRIVE YOUR CARE BECAUSE YOU HAD A TICKET GET YOUR NOSES OUT OF THE AIR COME DOWN OUT OF THE SALINA SNOB HILL AND GET DOWN TO EARTH IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THE SMOKE STAY OUT AND AWAY FROM WHERE THEY ALLOW SMOKE AND FOR THE ESTABLISHMENTS THAT ALLOWED SMOKING MAYBE IF YOU WERE SMART ENOUGH TO PUT THE SMOKING SECTION IN THE BACK AND US SMOKERS WAITING TO SMOKE WHEN WE GET DONE EATING WE ALL WOULD PROBABLY NOT EVEN BE HAVING THIS DISCUSSION RIGHT NOW
4/30/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Citizen Kane, the thing is not about smokers versus non smokers. I don't smoke, I prefer to be in places where there is not smoke, but I beleive in limited government governing our individual lives and our businesses. If the individual business wants to go non smoking, fine. We just don't want government telling us every little thing we can and cannot do!
4/29/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
llinois boy, you need to remember something. This ain't Illinois! We don't need our politicians telling us what we can and cannot do with our private businesses. Since you are from the land of corrupt politicians, these bans imposed by worthless government wastes of skin probably make you feel right at home, don't they. Since you are so proud of the fact that you are from Illinois, why don't you either stay there or move there? We don't need your liberal nanny state mentality in Kansas.
4/29/2009
Hawk says....
Older Teen, getting a ticket for public intoxication is a hell of alot cheaper than a DUI or killing someone or yourself. By the way, why are you worried about being intoxicated since your supposedly a teen?? Another thing, learn how to spell "you" and "are"!!
4/29/2009
sheila says....
Simply AMAZED. The new Council members said that they supported small business rights, then they just sat there and did NOTHING. Looks like SEVERAL somebodies lied flat out. AMAZING
4/29/2009
Citizen Kane says....
I find it humorous some of the pathetic posts made by smokers on here. "blahblahblah" says that "if you don't like smoke, go somwhere else." Well, the same thing applies to you fool! If you want to smoke, go somewhere else. No one wants to smell your nasty self! Just another dumb Liberal comment with no real brains or common sense behind it.
4/29/2009
Aaron says....
Older Teen: What language was that???? Good lord it isn't that hard to spell Y.O.U. or A.R.E. Learn to freaking spell. "ok so if we r cat a bar u r saying that us smokers have to go outside and that a chance on getting a ticket for intoxiction in public
4/29/2009
jason says....
welcome to the 21st century salina.Not having to breath second hand smoke should be a right,that goes for you dopers and mariuana as well.
4/29/2009
says says....
Just goes to show how trustworthy candidates who run for city,county offices are in Salina/Saline County really are. Angell,Arpke and Jennings said they were for letting business owners deciede to smoke or not to smoke at their businesses, now all of a sudden they ignore Gary Swartzendrubers plea to vote on the issue. Out of the woodwork comes Arron Peck , who by the way proably has not said too much the past 11/2 yrs at a city commission meeting except yes or no, and goes bananas at Swartzendruber. I voted for all 3 of these "people" but I guess I learned my lesson. Thought Salina got rid of 2 faced people on the city commisson when Jilka and Perney left, guess not.
4/29/2009
OLDER TEEN says....
ok so if we r cat a bar u r saying that us smokers have to go outside and that a chance on getting a ticket for intoxiction in public
4/29/2009
Keri says....
Way to go Salina!
4/28/2009
illinois boy says....
I am happy to finally see a strong Smoking Ban in Salinas. It is way overdue. Most smokers even favor the new Law.
4/28/2009
Brenda says....
i think we should let the owners of the establishments decide whether or not to have smoking in their bulding. this is the land of the free so why are taking rights away from some.
4/28/2009
Smoke Free Kansas says....
Please Step Outside To Smoke-Thank You!! What is so difficult about that??
4/28/2009
Smoke Free Kansas says....
Who could be so ignorant at to confuse "business rights" with the right to enter a business open to the PUBLIC and breathe clean fresh smoke free air?? What is so difficult about asking smokers to step outside and smoke?? Some of you hicks in Salina are having trouble with going outside to smoke?? Get off your lazy a** and step outside.
4/28/2009
frieda says....
to chuck : you all have the choice of where to stop or not ! a sad day indeed that 2 ignore the other 3 !
4/28/2009
Lucretius says....
This is an excellent example of the antiAmerican stupidity of our citizens who don't want freedom and the right to choose. They want the government to perpetually hold their hands and keep the monster in the closet. I don't need nor want that kind of suffocating protection from our Government. I believe in freedom--apparently most citizens do not anymore. They are tearing away the wall, brick by brick, of freedom.
4/28/2009
Chris says....
The wording should be: "Does a private business owner have the right to allow a legal behavior on their privately owned business property? YES or NO
4/28/2009
Amy says....
It would seem to me that you had enough before, this is needless, not to mention that Im pretty sure alot of people in America are getting tired of useless laws and regulations being forced down their throat when money could be spent better else where. THis is not fair and impartial representation by the city comission.
4/28/2009
says....
A person using a cell phone does not affect another person
4/28/2009
Herr Kommissar says....
Hey Chuck--- The only places that you can currently smoke in Salina is Bars and Bingo Parlors. Why are you so concerned about them? Do your friends and relatives frequently go to those places? When you are passing through do you stop to get a few beers before you get on the road again? What is the next thing to ban? When I drive past Bosselman's Truck Plaza every morning on the interstate, the Ninth Street exchange reeks of diesel fumes. Diesel fumes are not good for you either. Lets ban semi's!!!!!!!!!!
4/28/2009
aaron says....
Again, we should move forward and ban ALL sales of tobacco in Salina!!!!! If its THAT bad we should not be allowed to buy it!
4/28/2009
blahblahblah says....
Meh...I'm tired of all this crap. I like that it's smoke free, but dammit, sometimes I like to enjoy a smoke with my after dinner cocktail and if a restaurant wishes to cater to me and others like me they should be allowed to do so! If you don't like the smoke, go somewhere else. If you don't like to work in smoke get another job!
4/28/2009
says....
Cell phone are not good for our health, i think we should banned cell phones in public places
4/28/2009
chuck says....
We don't live in Salina but have friends and relatives there and appreciate what the city has done to reduce exposure to tobacco smoke. We also pass through quite often and appreciate the fact that we can stop at anytime and not be exposed to secondhand smoke. Thank you Salina.
4/28/2009
says....
good job commissioners..Keep it up...
4/28/2009
Bob says....
Voting is not allowed. Read the instructions. www.no-smoke.org/pdf/CIA_Fundamentals.pdf
4/28/2009
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